When will Randy Orton return to the main event in WWE?
Is Randy Orton still a main event performer?
That question might seem crazy since he is clearly one of the top three superstars in the WWE along with John Cena and CM Punk. Perhaps the better question is why hasn't WWE been using Orton as a main event attraction on its pay shows over the last two years?
I wanted to find out some basic summary information about who has been participating in these WWE pay-per-view (PPV) main events during the Cena/Orton era, and I am beginning at August 2004 because that was Randy Orton's first PPV main event match. From August 2004 through today, WWE has scheduled 106 PPV events. That means there have been 106 main event matches spanning those shows. My definition of the term "main event" is the match that ends the show. The only exceptions to that would include any Money in the Bank cash-ins that occurred to close out a show, such as Alberto Del Rio's championship victory at SummerSlam 2011. I consider the main event of that PPV to be Cena vs Punk.
Here is a breakdown of what I found out about these main event matches and how Randy Orton compares to everyone else.
First I’ll look at the type of match that was placed in the main event spot during those 106 shows:
1 vs 1: 66 matches
Triple Threat: 9 matches
Elimination Chamber: 7 matches
Royal Rumble: 6 matches
2 vs 2 Tag Team: 6 matches
Fatal Four-Way: 5 matches
Large Tag Team Matches: 4 matches
Championship Scramble: 1 match
5-Pack Challenge: 1 match
6-Pack Challenge: 1 match
Initially, I am most interested in those 66 one-on-one main event matches. This is because I consider the one-on-one matches to generally be the much better indicator of who WWE is pushing the hardest. The multi-man main event matches (like the Elimination Chamber) will often find some midcard guys like John Morrison thrown into a main event match, but if WWE really thought he had drawing power, chances are he would find himself in an occasional one-on-one main event match on a PPV. Here is the breakdown of which wrestlers have appeared in these 66 one-on-one matches since August 2004:
26 Matches: John Cena, Chavo Guerrero
12 Matches: Undertaker, HHH, Orton
11 Matches: Batista
9 Matches: Edge
6 Matches: CM Punk
5 Matches: JBL
4 Matches: HBK, Jeff Hardy
3 Matches: Barrett, Jericho, Angle
2 Matches: Miz, Mark Henry, Great Khali, Booker T, Mysterio
1 Match: ADR, R-Truth, Kane, Sheamus, Lashley, Umaga, RVD, Eddie Guerrero, Hogan, Big Show, Flair, Benoit
Most of WWE’s regular main event performers in this time are either out of the company now or are just part-time workers (Undertaker, HHH, Batista, Edge). Orton is clearly the most established active main-eventer after Cena. But three of Orton’s main event matches came in the second half of 2004 around the time of his initial title run, and six others came from August 2007 through October 2009 when he feuded with Cena and HHH. But things have been different for Orton since the start of November 2009. There have been 28 PPV events in that time with 15 one-on-one main event matches out of these 28 shows. Here is the number of times each superstar appeared in one of those 15 one-on-one main-event matches:
10 Matches: John Cena
3 Matches: CM Punk, Wade Barrett
2 Matches: Orton, Miz, Undertaker, Batista
1 Match: ADR, HHH, R-Truth, Kane, Sheamus, HBK
Things look even worse for Orton when some context is added here. Both of his main event matches came against Wade Barrett in October and Nov. 2010. And both times Randy Orton was playing second fiddle to John Cena in that feud. This was when Cena was forced to be a member of Nexus. Cena was in Barrett’s corner in one of these main event matches and Cena was the referee in the other main event match. Cena was risking being fired both times if Barrett lost to Orton. So those storylines and stipulations both revolved around how Cena would react to helping or hurting Barrett because Cena’s job was on the line. Randy Orton didn’t really matter too much in this feud even though Orton main-evented two PPV shows during that time. The main story was that Barrett needed Cena’s help to try to win the gold, and Orton just happened to be the guy holding the championship at the time.
So what about the other 40 PPV main events? 40 of the 106 PPV shows did not have a one-on-one match in the main event spot. I ignored these matches in the summaries above. But for the sake of thoroughness, here is how many times each superstar competed in one of these other main event matches. I am going to exclude the six Royal Rumble main event matches, so that leaves 34 other main event matches. These main events would include all Triple Threat Matches, Fatal 4-Ways, 5-Pack Challenges, 6-Pack Challenges, Championship Scrambles, Elimination Chambers, 2 vs 2 Tag Team Matches, and Large Tag Team Matches.
18 Matches: John Cena
10 Matches: HHH, HBK, Edge
9 Matches: Orton, Jericho
7 Matches: Batista
5 Matches: JBL, Booker T, CM Punk
4 Matches: Undertaker, Morrison, R-Truth, Big Show, Mysterio, Lashley
3 Matches: Kane, Sheamus
2 Matches: Miz, ADR, Barrett, Jeff Hardy, Angle, Benoit, Finlay, Carlito, Masters
1 Match: The Rock, Bret Hart, Mick Foley, Daniel Bryan, 6 non-Barrett Nexus members who aren’t worth naming, Umaga, RVD, Eddie Guerrero, Cody Rhodes, Ted DiBiase, Mike Knox, Spirit Squad, Test, Chavo Guerrero, Hardcore Holly, Dvon Dudley, Bubba Ray Dudley, Tommy Dreamer, Sandman, Snitsky, Maven
Orton looks respectable on this list, but six of Orton’s nine main event matches here came prior to November 2009. So he hasn’t even been finding himself in too many group main events either over the last two years. His three most recent non-Rumble main event matches here would include Elimination Chamber in February 2011, a 6-Pack Challenge match in September 2010, and a Fatal 4-Way in June 2010.
Finally, to get a better idea on the more recent main event landscape, here is a summary of how many times each superstar competed in any PPV main event match (excluding Royal Rumbles) since November 2009, regardless of match type. There have been 28 such main events in that time:
18 Matches: John Cena
7 Matches: CM Punk
5 Matches: Barrett, R-Truth, Orton, Miz
4 Matches: Sheamus, Jericho, Morrison
3 Matches: HBK, Undertaker, HHH, Edge, ADR
2 Matches: Batista
1 Match: The Rock, Bret Hart, Daniel Bryan, 6 non-Barrett Nexus members who still aren’t worth naming, Big Show, Mysterio, Kane
0 Matches: Chavo Guerrero
Randy Orton wrestled on every single one of these 28 shows, which is something even John Cena couldn’t manage to accomplish. But this list shows that when it comes to main-eventing PPV’s in the last 2 years, Orton is no longer a cut above the rest. He is just another name in the cluttered group of wrestlers way below John Cena. Would you consider any of these other active guys like Barrett, Truth, or Miz to be main-eventers? If not, then is it fair to say that Randy Orton is no longer a main-eventer? Orton has only competed in 5 of these main event matches in the last 28 PPV shows since November 2009 (excluding Royal Rumbles). So is Randy Orton still a main-eventer? If so, why has WWE rarely focused on him as the focal point for any pay show over the last two years? Is it simply a matter of being in Cena’s huge shadow as well as being stuck on Smackdown without any other comparable stars of Orton’s magnitude? Or does WWE think that Orton isn’t that great of a draw in a one-on-one feud with anybody besides HHH or Cena? Has Orton’s run as a face produced any memorable storylines or feuds worth focusing a pay show on? Would Orton be more likely to grab back some of the spotlight if he went back to being a heel? Or does he just need John Cena to get injured again so that WWE is forced to put the spotlight on other stars?
Finally, here are some miscellaneous tidbits that caught my attention.
- It seems that Cena’s percentages of PPV main event matches has risen over these last two years as the other regular main eventers (HBK, Taker, HHH, Edge, etc) have fallen off the map and Cena has remained healthy. I think you really can argue that Cena is the only regular main eventer WWE has right now.
- Chris Jericho only had 3 one-on-one main event matches in this time span, and they occurred consecutively on the three PPV’s in October and November 2008. The first two matches occurred when John Cena was out with an injury, and the third match was Cena’s return match where Cena immediately won the championship from Jericho. I expected a higher number of these PPV main events from Jericho, but it seems that the overwhelming majority of his PPV main event matches have been matches involving more than two performers.
- Of the 12 wrestlers with exactly one PPV main event one-on-one match since August 2004, 6 of them came against John Cena (Umaga, Lashley, R-Truth, ADR, Sheamus, RVD).
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Since the beginning of 2009 there have been 24 main event one-on-one matches out of 40 PPV shows. Only 6 of these 24 matches did not include Cena, Undertaker, or HHH as one of the two participants, although Cena was involved in the Barrett/Orton matches in other ways. These matches include the following:
Barrett vs Orton (November 2010)
Barrett vs Orton (October 2010)
Hardy vs Punk (August 2009)
Hardy vs Punk (July 2009)
Hardy vs Edge (June 2009)
Hardy vs Edge (May 2009) - Doesn’t it seem like 40 out of 106 is an awfully high percentage of non one-on-one main event matches for the pay shows? If so, is this because WWE generally sucks at creating interesting one-on-one programs and so they often just throw in a bunch of top stars with John Cena in a group match and expect people to buy it? I think WWE has been at its best in this time span when there are interesting one-on-one championship feuds, such as Punk/Cena, HHH/Batista, HBK/Jericho, Punk/Hardy, Edge/Taker, Cena/Batista, etc. But it seems that WWE has trouble creating or sustaining these interesting stories and so there are way too many group main event matches. But then again 13 of those 40 matches are either Elimination Chamber Matches or Royal Rumble Matches, which I almost always enjoy. So if those matches are excluded, that leaves 27 out of 93 total main event matches on PPV that were not non one-on-one matches. Is that percentage still too high?
- Even though I started in August 2004, John Cena’s first one-on-one main event PPV match came in May 2005. Starting with that show, WWE has scheduled 95 PPV events. Cena has wrestled on 77 of these shows (he’s missed several shows due to injuries and brand-specific PPV cards). Cena wrestled in the main event of 47 of these 77 shows.
- Cena and Orton fought each other on 5 consecutive pay shows from July through October 2009 (including 4 one-on-one matches), but only one of these matches was the main event. Randy Orton even has trouble getting the main event spot when he is feuding with Cena.
The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Cageside Seats readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Cageside Seats editors or staff.
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I think it’s a combination of three things (or two things depending on how you look at it)…
1: Cena appears so much. When you have one guy eating up a slot so often everyone else’s numbers sink simple because there are less slots to put them in.
2: Cena & Orton are both faces. While both of them being faces doesn’t preclude the other from appearing if the WWE wants to have a traditional face vs. heel dynamic they have to choose one or the other and the WWE has obviously regarded Cena as the #1 face in the company.
3: Orton is on Smackdown (at least in theory). The WWE considers Raw the “A” show and SD the “B” show so most likely the main event is going to be the Raw centerpiece.
At least that’s my theory.
Yeah those reasons all make sense. I think the fact that he is stuck on Smackdown without any other main eventers around him is what’s holding him back from getting involved in huge PPV matches. As far as star power goes, do you think Orton is better off in his current position as the top face on Smackdown, or would he be better off back on the A show (Raw) but clearly in second or third place to Cena and maybe even Punk?
I heard grumblings around Wrestlemania time that Randy Orton was very angry that his match with CM Punk didn’t get a higher spot on the card. So I wonder how aware and/or sensitive Randy Orton is to his spot on these PPV cards over these last two years. Does anybody know how his compensation is affected for working lower spots on the pay shows?
Had to stop..
The Chavo stuff has me gigglin’ like a school girl. Thx 4 da laffs man.
You are a man, right? Not a little red monster? haha.
Heh, thanks for the feedback. I figured if I am going to torture you guys with a 2000 word post that I should at least throw one joke in there. I even have a “chavo guerrero sucks” tag somewhere in there, I think.
I didn’t see that.. but I read fast… or maybe I’m just too stoked & wanted to get to the end & was laughing.. whatever.
So, I think its a great piece. The one hard issue I have is the duel & sometimes triple main events.. or whatever. If you want to know if someone is a player.. then look no further than 9 HW championships. Punk is the only other active person, aside from Crapnation.. to be at 5 or better. That speaks louder than who they get to ME PPV to me.. anyway.
As for Jericho.. he did get the big money match w/ Randy The Ram & then the Dragon & they stretched that all out..
I think the way is goes is like this… Cena by virtue of aesthetics is always in the ME slot.. because when he’s not.. I think the WWe freaks out.. they are like.. WHOOOA.. wait.. How they actually managed TLC w/o a Cena match period is beyond me.. but might be a sign of the times… things are getting ready to change some… so like anyone would, they test their theories, and Cena was left off.. which made the most sense since to put him anywhere else on the card just wouldn’t look right.. and would, I think, diminish Cena even more.. Plus, leaving him off did add intrigue to how it might play out. I certainly was. At this point, I’m rambling because I have a point & cannot find the right words to articulate it the exact way I would like.. so I’m just talking around the subject hoping that the words just come to me…. They haven’t.
I feel like Orton is a top tier worker, has a really good character that can be spun into an insanely bad ass heel.. when they decide to pull the trigger. His feud w/ Punk was incredible.. and Orton’s willingness to put people over like crazy lately is going to pay huge dividends later. Unlike Cena.. who once the Rock is gone, what’s he going to do? We already know.. he’ll have to belt flipped back on to him.. but let’s enjoy these last couple months of a Cena-less nation.
by Rawuncutnxrated on Jan 2, 2012 8:42 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah I get what you are saying. I agree that simply listing who has closed out PPV shows is too narrow as there are plenty of big matches that end up happening at earlier spots in the card. But for the sake of looking all of this up I just wanted to keep my definition of main event simple and not let any subjectivity get in the way.
I think Orton has done a good job of maintaining his star power and that, like you said, it is a matter of them just flipping the switch. he can main event at any time if they just give him someone interesting to work with (kind of like Punk and Jericho).
Hey, I get it.. you had a theory, you made your thesis.. and you investigated. You kept an open mind in your investigation & reported your findings… the crack pots who did the Climate stuff could learn a few things from you. At least that’s my semi-professional opinion as a science guy. You did really good work. And yea, the fact the Cena is the guy who gets the main stories attached to his character is disturbing. At some point the well has to dry up.. hell, they are going a full year a way to try to make him interesting w/ his stories. I think the well is way past dried & they are drilling for new aquifers.. and CM Punk is looking like he’s the most promising.
by Rawuncutnxrated on Jan 2, 2012 8:52 PM EST up reply actions
Do you think that at least one of the top 3 guys (Cena, Orton, Punk) will have to go heel soon? Can you really have your top 3 guys as all faces with no superstar heels around?
In my opinion..
Yea.. to make things interesting.. but for WWE who are having issues across the board with PPVs & ratings. They have to keep them faces to move merch I would suspect. At least that will get them revenue.
by Rawuncutnxrated on Jan 3, 2012 10:06 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah i'd be willing to bet his matches most likely in the past 2 years
have been the second to last match. He’s the 1B, so he gets the co-main event a lot. I still hear him get the biggest F’n pop in the world, but its hard to embroil him in money feuds because he isn’t that interesting, so how do u get people to want to pay to see the outcome of a Randy Orton feud when it won’t matter cuz it isn’t an interesting feud lol. Even his merchandise isn’t interesting loll
I guess they are hoping “Apex Predator” catches on, huh? Would you buy an “Apex Predator” shirt for a little kid?
Same people who’d buy Rise Above Hate.. and then see their little nerdy kids come home beaten down.
by Rawuncutnxrated on Jan 2, 2012 8:43 PM EST up reply actions
Another interesting thing is that Orton hasn’t even been the second main event in many cases this year. Here are some examples from this year:
His match was at TLC 2011 aired 3rd on the 10-match card.
His match at Survivor Series aired 3rd on of the 6-match card.
His match at Vengeance aired 6th on the 8-match card.
His title rematch against Henry at HIAC aired 4th on the 7-match card.
His title loss to Henry at NOC aired 4th out of 7 matches.
His match at Extreme Rules with Punk was the PPV opener.
His match with Punk at WM27 aired 4th on the 8-match card.
His title match at TLC 2010 aired 5th on the 7-match card.
To be fair.. those gimmick PPV’s.. they split up the gimmicks… like it really f’n matters.. they are all watered down anyway.. so its like Raw.. the Co/ME is at the beginning of the 2nd hour.. ha!
by Rawuncutnxrated on Jan 2, 2012 8:45 PM EST up reply actions
I was actually gonna look this up after Raw, so thank you for posting it
It’s actually a little shocking when you look at the hard numbers. I was going to argue that he would be co-main event, but what you posted above kinda pokes a hole in that. I think once he gets back, whenever that will be, he’ll be in the picture for the WWE Championship. Hopefully that doesn’t mean Punk heads back to Smackdown, but that’s most likely what will happen.
Great post as always Kaneite. I enjoy reading your stuff
So go forth, my brethren, and proceed to mark the f*ck out
by C. J. Bradford on Jan 2, 2012 8:47 PM EST up reply actions
And by posts I mean comments
But you should post more
So go forth, my brethren, and proceed to mark the f*ck out
by C. J. Bradford on Jan 2, 2012 8:48 PM EST up reply actions
This factor may have something to do with how WWE has been booking matches below the main event
Specifically, it seems WWE is OK yielding the second-to-last spot as a “breather” for people in between main event and “co-main event” type matches. For example, if the divas match is not on second, I’m almost certain it’s on second-to-last as a breather between title matches, for example.
A good deal of the rest of this explanation is his status on Smackdown and his recent face turn. For a while, he had not been established as a babyface, and that’s hard to do when you essentially don’t change your character and have to feud with DiBiase and Rhodes. When they went to him in 2010, he was overshadowed by Cena throughout his title run, including in his rematches with Miz. After that, he was in the Punk feud, which quickly became midcard with Nexus involved.
In total, I think the time frame you focused on (past November 2009) encompasses some rough patches in Orton’s career: his babyface readjustment time, his first failed babyface title run under Cena and Nexus’s shadow (unsurprising that it failed under the weight of that program), his midcard Punk feud, and his move to the B-show. Not surprising he hasn’t been at the top billing of PPV lately.
Fish Stripes, a Florida Marlins blog
Author, Baseball Prospectus Fantasy
by Michael Jong on Jan 2, 2012 11:56 PM EST up reply actions
I think a big part of the problem is that the top Smackdown heels this year that Orton feuded with this year (Christian, Henry, Barrett) are mostly guys that WWE isn’t likely to put in the main event spot. If guys like Edge or Batista were still around as a heel on Smackdown then perhaps Orton would have headlined a PPV with some of them. But both of Orton’s title matches with Mark Henry were places squarely in the middle of the PPV card, with 3 matches left to go. His matches with Christian generally did get the co-main event billing, but I was disappointed that WWE wouldn’t even let just one of them main event a PPV considering how great those matches were. Hell, they let R-Truth main event a PPV in June in a 1-on-1 match rather than give it to Orton-Christian.
In general, WWE is sorely lacking in main event heels on both shows, especially since Miz and ADR are no longer on the rise and don’t look like they will be legit main-eventers any time soon. Hopefully Rhodes, Barrett, and Ziggler will fare better as they try to break into the main event scene this year.
Forgot to mention this:
In 2009 when Edge, Hardy, Punk, and Taker were all on Smackdown, 5 of WWE’s 12 non-Rumble PPVs were headlined by a Smackdown match. In 2008 another 4 or 5 PPVs were headlined by a Smackdown match. But in 2010 that number dropped to 2, and I didn’t count any Smackdown main events on any PPVs this year at all.
So it seems that while Smackdown has always been the B-Show, it had its fair share of PPV main events in 2008 and 2009 thanks to star power from Taker and Edge and Hardy. But these last 2 years it really has been neglected to an extreme extent.
Not that.. the Fiesta Bowl.. haha. We get to see how these guys didn’t get indicted.
by Rawuncutnxrated on Jan 2, 2012 8:47 PM EST up reply actions
Big 10 lost again in the Rose Bowl.
Its not even challenging. Now I see why the Pac-12 wants to compete against them in a rivalry every year.
it was wisconson
so for me who cares?
"Never take your eyes off of your opponent…even when you bow."
Its the Big 10.. they don’t have a legit team in that conference. They can’t even match up w/ the Pac 12.. The SEC would destroy them.
by Rawuncutnxrated on Jan 3, 2012 10:04 PM EST up reply actions
Another Orton post? How many of you are in love with him? Is it the way he bangs his fist against the ground right before he does the RKO….no wait I know, it’s how he abuses his power to get people demoted or even fired if he doesn’t get his way but it’s okay to break Punk’s nose earlier this year and is able to get another world title push and a chance to be the face of SD!. Guess if you come whining like a bitch to the boss then you are entitled to get a title shot whenever you want and a promotion to boot.
you're own stupidity will lead you to your own downfall
by congestedthoughts on Jan 2, 2012 11:31 PM EST reply actions
Congrats and your shortest comment ever
So go forth, my brethren, and proceed to mark the f*ck out
by C. J. Bradford on Jan 3, 2012 9:44 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No, its the way you bump your fingers on the keyboard as you get more & more pissed because people take an interest in Orton. How many keyboards you go through a month? I bet some of them are still under warranty.
by Rawuncutnxrated on Jan 3, 2012 10:03 PM EST up reply actions

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