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The Absurdity of Mark Henry's Main Event Push

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Promoted to the front page by CagesideSeats.com.

For reasons that don't even hold up to rudimentary scrutiny, Mark Henry has recieved yet another huge push by the WWE. The difference between this one and the last eight or nine is that this one has lead to a Smackdown title reign and a huge amount of love from the smark community.

Henry winning the Smackdown world title isn't all that big of a surprise. After the Kane and Great Khali title reigns, the bar for champions is already several notches below the old WWF Intercontinental champions. As a wrestling fan for many years of my life, I've grown to accept such booking as a way of life that I simply shouldn't fret over. If I threw a fit over every inexplicable booking decision involving champions, I would've died of a heart attack back in 1991.

What I can't accept, though, is the inexplicable love the Internet Wrestling Community (IWC) has been showering on Mark Henry, of all people.

"Henry's finally gotten his due," they say. "Henry deserves it. He brings a lot to the table. Let's have Henry face the Undertaker again!"

Actually, I already have a pretty good idea on why people love Mark Henry so much. Regardless of how bad somebody is at wrestling, if they're ever booked as hot sh*t, look imposing, and can execute their moves without obviously botching them, who wouldn't like them? Ultimate Warrior became a huge star by doing slightly over two thirds of that.

But the thing is, that trick shouldn't fool the supposedly "smart" fans. It never works in the long run. Regardless of mark or smark fan status, people stop flocking to buildings once the guy who's made champion can't cut the mustard. Ultimate Warrior's live gates and pay-per-view (PPV) buyrates were the largest drop-offs of revenue the WWF had ever seen once they made Warrior champion instead of Hulk Hogan.

Hell, the Kane title reign worked exactly the same as Mark Henry's reign, it happened only a year ago, and people consider the Kane title reign the worst thing the WWE has done in years.

Why does Henry get the pass?

Star-divide

Before mustering up a defense, it's best to ask some important questions about Henry.

  • Henry has been a pro wrestler for almost two decades, but has he ever had a match that was even at a level one would consider "good," let alone great?
  • Henry winning the title was lauded because the guy who was with the company forever finally "got his due," but what does it even mean for a guy to "get his due" when the guy in question is Mark Henry? Henry has received more money in base pay than any other wrestler in WWE history despite never being a draw, never having even one great match, and never cutting a particularly great promo. Shouldn't one million dollars guaranteed a year be more than enough?
  • It also shouldn't be suggested that Mark Henry hasn't received enough opportunities. He has already received major pushes by WWE in 1996, 1998, 2002, 2003, 2006, 2007, 2008, and 2009. Henry has worked major matches with Rey Mysterio, Shawn Michaels, Kurt Angle, and worked a WrestleMania match with Undertaker, and all those matches sucked, often with people blaming his opponents declining abilities for the matches being bad. Would this pattern be acceptable for anyone else in the company?
  • Henry was offered his huge contract because of his huge physique, and the fact that he was competing to win the 1996 Olympics, which was a laughable proposition even in 1996. Henry didn't even place in the single digits of the 1992 Olympics, which he competed at a time when he had a healthy back.
  • Ignoring that Henry was an Olympian in an event completely unrelated to pro wrestling (he was a weightlifter, as most already know), a lot of people who competed in the Olympics who did much better than Mark Henry never earned base pay even close to what he did while competing in actual combat sports events. Ken Shamrock beat U.S. Olympic Judo team member Christophe Leininger in his debut UFC fight back in 1994, did Shamrock earn close to what Henry earned? Hiroshi Hase actually placed in the single digits in the 1984 Summer Olympics in Greco-Roman wrestling, was Hase even offered a contract by the WWF? This doesn't even get into men like Kurt Angle and Danny Hodge.
  • People say that Mark Henry's a great heel because of how dominant he is, but any booker could make any wrestler on any roster dominant; it doesn't make them good. A great heel should be a guy who makes you want to pay money to see them get their ass kicked in a match, and is there anyone that people actually want to see Mark Henry face in a wrestling match?
  • For that matter, is their anybody in WWE alone of a suitable "hoss" build who couldn't get the exact same push, with or without Vickie Guerrero as their mouthpiece, and be better at everything than Henry if only for the fact that said hoss would probably be easier to lift for their opponent?

In the end, the only justification for Henry being champion is "he's big," and "he's a nice guy," which is little reason to love the guy who should be the number two most important person in the company. John Cena meets both those qualifications, but does anyone ever want to see Cena even contend for the belt again unless he's facing CM Punk on PPV a third time? Let alone steamroll the entire company again?

It's time for people to give up on their Mark Henry love. If a guy can make $1 million a year despite being terrible at the job they've had for two decades, they don't deserve anything extra from anybody.

The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Cageside Seats readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Cageside Seats editors or staff.

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I voted greatest champion ever

to skew results cuz ur poll is useless. Why poll the same crowd that ur saying is in Mark Henry’s corner? loll its like going to a steelers blog and polling if they think any team is better than the steelers.

by Lexxi on Nov 22, 2011 3:33 PM EST reply actions  

Different strokes for different folks

I really enjoyed the Mark Henry vs Big Show match where the ring collapsed. I enjoyed the whole match, not just the awesome finish. I also liked his title victory over Randy Orton. His promos afterward were great.

I’m probably not the type of fan that your criticism is aiming at. All I can say is that I enjoy his current run primarily due to his promos. To me, wrestling is more than just what happens in the ring.

by Manolo Has Pizzazz on Nov 22, 2011 3:35 PM EST reply actions  

your poll sucks

how about giving us some real options to choose from

Maslow's theory of higher needs does not apply to Patrick Willis. He only has two needs: tackling people and finding people to tackle.

by 49erLou on Nov 22, 2011 3:41 PM EST reply actions  

How can you tell a heel act is being effective?

Easy.

Do they draw money?

It doesn’t matter if the heel is getting booed or cheered if people are paying money or watching the TV to see their programs. The nWo got cheered all the time, and they were the most successful heel act WCW ever had because people paid money to see them fight, it didn’t matter that some fans wanted the nWo to die a fiery death, and other fans wanted the nWo to pulverize those WCW jobbers, the WCW fans just wanted to see them fight, and would pay any price to do so.

Will they elevate the babyface they’re in a program with?

This is the biggest measurement by which you judge how good a heel is. Anybody can pulverize people in five minute matches, but it takes a true artist to make the guy your in the ring with look good even if you’re going to pulverize them. I’m not asking a monster heel to bounce around like Ric Flair in every one of his matches, but when it comes time to face their big money opponent, a good monster heel has to elicit reactions from the fans during the match other than “this match sucks,” and “when will this shit be over?” Mark Henry can’t deliver in that department because all his matches suck, and nobody in the company today but John Cena, Kane, and Big Show can even lift his ass off the ground.

If fans don’t want to see your matches, you’re not a good wrestler. Largely because it renders you incapable of truly elevating your opponents.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 5:12 PM EST up reply actions  

You do realize that ratings have risen since Mark Henry became champion, right?

"...Man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much - the wheel, New York, wars and so on - whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man - for precisely the same reasons" - Douglas Adams

by Mercutio on Nov 22, 2011 6:45 PM EST up reply actions  

im tired of this excuse...seriously

EVERYONE DID NOT JUST WATCH BASKETBALL ON FRIDAY NIGHTS. and while yes the NBA is locked out, Mark Henry has made things interesting on Smackdown where the storylines are simple to the point and are portrayed well on screen. he has been able to keep a running program with big show as their main event for 2 straight PPVs and looking like a 3rd (TLC), and has more heat than the supposed “A” show main heel ADR….

If you have a problem with Henry thats your call, but to just say anyone can do it, well why hasn’t Vince’s “guy” Drew McIntyre gotten this push? Maybe its because Henry got it, rolled with it, and has excelled.

by DFreshMMA on Nov 22, 2011 7:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Both points are inaccurate

A. Henry’s drawing. His title reign has increased SD ratings and you can make excuses all you want, but companies aren’t going to measure excuses, they’re going to measure cold facts, and the cold facts show that SD ratings have improved during Henry’s title reign. Sure this could be the product of just better booking, or maybe people are tuning in to see Sheamus or Cody Rhodes by happenstance, but the logic points to the champion.

B. Of course Henry can elevate the babyface he’s with, and you could even put that all on booking. Henry has been dominant and near unbeatable in the last few months. So let’s say Daniel Bryan cashes in on Henry at WM (not likely to happen but this is hypothetical). Henry has been a juggernaut since October at this rate, so he’d be in the sixth month of a dominant title reign. You think if Daniel Bryan has a respectable program with Henry, where he gives the champ several good fights and ultimately takes the title, that he’d be elevated? Of course he would! He’d have beaten a guy twice his size who hadn’t lost more than a few matches in six months, at the biggest event of the year! He’d be instantly credible!

Beware my tiny electric fury.

by Gravity on Nov 22, 2011 7:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Of course drawing money is an aspect

As others have mentioned, ratings are up, and despite your claims that the NBA is the sole cause of this, it does seem likely given the three-month history of decent Smackdown ratings that Henry’s work has had a good deal to do with it. And the response tells you what’s happening: people are watching Henry and anticipating him getting beaten. They want to see it happen, hence their reaction.

Will he elevate a babyface he works with? Absolutely. His credible monster gimmick has everyone wondering who will finally go over on him. Outside of the latest Big Show match, no one was complaining about the match quality, despite the fact that they know he is limited in the ring. WWE was smart to put him with a great worker in Orton to start, and the first Big Show match was capped by the ring collapse, once again making for a memorable moment. People are excited to see who will go over him, and the person that eventually does will be mega-over for defeating a seemingly unbeatable champion. That is is what will ultimately make Henry’s reign successful, and if he continues to be booked strong and works well on the mic, it will happen.

by Michael Jong on Nov 23, 2011 9:50 AM EST up reply actions  

Meltzer’s ratings for Henry’s PPV matches this year

Mark Henry vs. Big Show (MiTB) one and a half stars

Mark Henry vs. Sheamus (Summerslam) one and a quarter stars

Mark Henry vs. Randy Orton (Night of Champions) two and three quarter stars

Mark Henry vs. Randy Orton (Hell in a Cell) two and a half stars

Mark Henry vs. Big Show (Vengeance) three and a quarter stars (the second Henry match above three stars in Henry’s entire career)

Mark Henry vs. Big Show (Survivor Series) one half of a star

Is this really what’s indicitive of the PPV matches a guy should put on when they’re booked as the most dominant force the company has seen from a heel since Brock Lesnar?

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 12:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Mark is a mark

You were at least providing a convincing argument until you brought this out. Star ratings really are only to gauge how interesting that singular individual found the match. A five star match to Meltzer (Who always skews towards the Japanese stuff) and say Cornette who helped create that system, will be different. It’s entirely subjective and is useless in any argument unless you, yourself feel those were the star ratings and are prepared to back them up. You have to take into account personal preferences in star ratings. You simply just quoted Meltzer as if his was the only critical opinion that mattered.

by docsteeler on Nov 28, 2011 10:05 AM EST up reply actions  

It's a much better source to quote than my own.

Meltzer has been watching wrestling from every continent for four decades. I could’ve put my own star ratings, but then you would’ve said I was just being biased, I could’ve put the PPV buyrates and live gates for Henry’s shows, they were horrific by the way, but then you would’ve said that live gates don’t matter.

Well, what does matter to you when judging if someone’s working. You can’t just day, “do I personally enjoy it,” you might not yet have seen enough great matches in enough styles to appreciate how good a big man can actually be when they’re not Mark Henry. You can’t say buyrates and gates don’t matter for a guy who’s supposed to be carrying their brand, because that’s the only real way to measure a wrestlers qualities while being completely subjective.

And the reason he skewed towards the Japanese stuff is because it really was better than the American stuff at the time. Go and actually watch Kobashi/Kikuchi vs. The Can-Am Express, or the five star six men matches, or Jumbo vs. Tenryu, and compare it to what was going on in the WWF or even WCW at the time. The only time period in which U.S. wrestling was matching up to the quality Japan produced at the time was in WCW back in 1989.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 28, 2011 11:14 AM EST up reply actions  

Not to mention that the only WWE hoss who actually needs a manager to be a better promo than Henry is Jack Swagger.

Sheamus, Big Show, Alberto Del Rio, and Wade Barrett are all better on the mic and in the ring than Henry, why not give those guys a huge monster heel push instead of spending months killing their heat?

Chris Masters and Luke Gallows are both better on the mic and in the ring than Henry, why not give those guys a huge monster heel push instead of firing them?

Husky Harris and Brodus Clay are both at around the same level as Henry in the ring and on the mic. They still need much more seasoning to be decent, but if WWE gave either of them a huge push, there’s at least a chance they’d become huge stars and good workers, as opposed to Henry, who everyone knows isn’t getting any better than where he is now.

Or, we could stop this nonsense about people needing to be hosses to get pushed as unstoppable badasses, and just give huge pushes to the guys who are best in the ring and on the mic? Really, any option is better than the Mark Henry push.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 5:27 PM EST up reply actions  

I thought this post was well done even though I don’t agree with most of it, but I am reccing this comment for the word “flippies.”

by Finian1 on Nov 23, 2011 9:24 AM EST up reply actions  

I've never asked wrestlers to flip for my amusement.

I hate flippydoo spot monkeys and no selling. What I do hate are brutality free, psycholigy free, one star snorefests put on by guys with horrible cardio and zero flexibility.

The reason why Henry’s so terrible is because he has the worst cardiovascular conditioning and least amount of flexibility of anyone in the company, including Kevin Nash. Even if you have no natural wrestling ability and can’t flip around or execute your moves with anything resembling grace, you can have great matches if you work on your cardio enough. Look at John Cena, he’s as graceful as a one legged mule, and the phoniest looking offense in the business, but because Cena has great cardio, he can have great matches with great workers. Look at CM Punk, he has zero natural athletic ability, but thanks to his fantastic cardio, he’s able to keep up a good pace in all his matches, and put on a five star match with John Cena of all people.

Sure, obviously cardio isn’t everything, if you don’t have psychology skills or interesting offensive maneuvers, you can only get so far, but even if you don’t have any of those, you can at least be carried to a quality match by someone who does, and if you don’t have cardio, you can’t develop interesting offense, or pull off psychology in the first place. Henry doesn’t have it, so he can’t. Ergo, all his matches suck.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 12:23 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't agree with the post but I thought it was good enough to go to the front page.

I dumped the poll, though. That had to go.

Good stuff, Asterisk.

Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.

by Geno Mrosko on Nov 22, 2011 5:40 PM EST reply actions  

Thanks. I'm fine with dumping the pole, it was a gag pole, but I don't need it to illustrate my point.

I’m just fed up with WWE killing the heat of so many guys I really like who could have bright futures. Guys like Alberto Del Rio, Dolph Ziggler, Zack Ryder, Cody Rhodes, Jack Swagger, Wade Barrett, Sheamus, Chris Masters, Luke Gallows, Colt Cabana, Bryan Danielson, and until recently, CM Punk are forced to shovel shit for a living by WWE, get over by sheer force of will, only to be shoved back down the card lower than ever before if they’re not fired. But for some reason, Mark Henry of all people gets pushed to the moon. Think of what anybody in the company other than Henry could be doing if they were pushed in his position right now.

I have nothing against Henry as a person, but if a guy can’t bring it in the ring, they shouldn’t be pushed to the moon, let alone one of the only guys in the company who doesn’t have his heat killed on a regular basis.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 5:58 PM EST up reply actions  

You should have told him to ditch the bogus numbers too. In the summer of 1996, Mark Henry signed a ten year contract for $250,000 per annum. Though that was a lot of money guaranteed at the time (I’m guessing only Shawn Michaels and maybe Marc Mero had a sweeter deal in the WWF at the time), it was quickly dwarfed by the contracts of Bret Hart, Ken Shamrock and Paul “Big Show” Wight amongst many others, as the WWF gave out more downside guaranteed contracts to compete with WCW.

by Keith Harris on Nov 23, 2011 9:15 AM EST up reply actions  

The contract was for one million dollars a year.

Sure, by the time the contract expired in 2006, the pay went down to only three hundred thousand, but that’s still a lot of money for a guy who’s never drawn and never had a good match. Not to mention, the extension was signed right after Henry injured Batista and Kurt Angle, and after Henry put on some of the worst main event matches in WWE history against Kurt Angle, Undertaker, and Rey Mysterio of all people.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 12:33 PM EST up reply actions  

What’s your source for that number? Dave Meltzer has consistently reported the number I quoted, most recently in a story in the Wrestling Observer Newsletter when Henry won the title:

Perhaps being worked by Todd’s hype and thinking he was getting an Olympic medalist right off national television, McMahon signed Henry to a ten-year contract at $250,000 per year, a tenure completely unheard of in wrestling.

by Keith Harris on Nov 23, 2011 1:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Lagana/the IWantWrestling Podcast put him over as being a good ad libber, and during this run, I think he’s utilized that. I know, I know, “hall of pain,” that’s not the coolest catch phrase, but otherwise I like his mic work. Other Monster heels skew for generic “I will crush you” sentiments, but Mark Henry plays his character not just angry, but hateful. I thought his title win over Randy Orton was a great story, not for physicality but for all the acting involved.

I thought Kane’s recent run was fine, too, I just wish they did something with it instead of letting him shrink back. I mean, they let him put down The Undertaker, and then he turns de facto face (as in he didn’t do anything heelish in 2 weeks so we might as well make him a good guy) and then becomes Mark Henry fodder.

by evisruc on Nov 22, 2011 5:46 PM EST reply actions  

If I remember correctly,

Henry writes poems (he wrote one for Owen), which means he has that certain amount of intelligence to express himself. I guess he finally got to use it now and able to act and ad lib effectively.

by Man from Manila on Nov 22, 2011 11:28 PM EST up reply actions  

This whole article is basically a cynical bitch fest. Complete garbage; go work for Gawker where nerd baiting is acceptable.

by HouseRN on Nov 22, 2011 5:56 PM EST reply actions  

But Henry isn't that guy.

Mark Henry has earned more money in base pay than anybody else in WWE history. From the moment he came into the company he was given a guaranteed contract for one million dollars every year he worked for them regardless of what he did for the company: and this isn’t the first time WWE has pushed Henry to the moon. Henry has had countless opportunities tossed his way beforehand, and he was responsible for each one of them going belly up.

Think of Del Rio, you said that WWE is incapable of making younger guys look compelling, but if Del Rio took out Kane, Great Khali, and Big Show, and then beat Randy Orton clean, he’d be exactly as over as Henry is, and he could do everything Henry’s doing now, except it’d be better. There was nothing stopping Vince McMahon from giving Mark Henry’s push to anyone else on the roster.

Not to mention, Cody Rhodes and Wade Barrett already gained legitimacy largely by working hard at it without help from WWE. Last year Wade Barrett got more heat than Vicky Guerrero, Barrett was literally shaking buildings with how much people hated him, but rather than keep his push steady like WWE has done with Henry, they jobbed Barrett out in every match he was in. Cody Rhodes was over as anyone could be two years ago, people were begging for him to take out Orton, but rather than have Rhodes do to Orton what Batista did to Triple H, they just had Cena beat Orton, and turned Orton face against his own stable.

It isn’t that WWE’s incapable of pushing people properly, Vince McMahon made the decision to kill the heat of everyone in the company except a select group he gives preferential treatment towards. Henry’s obviously part of that group.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 6:12 PM EST up reply actions  

I won’t argue too much because the idea of arguing about who shouldn’t and shouldn’t get a push is a bit depressing.

Still, I see where you’re coming from. It’s a shame a younger and more versatile guy hasn’t been pushed instead and it might have been (a) more entertaining and (b) better for the business if they had. But, then, it’s a shame that Cena is being pushed at the expense of everyone else on the roster. It’s a shame that Orton has all the character of brown bread. It’s a shame the “divas” a bad joke. It’s a shame that Mason Ryan - well, Mason Ryan is a shame. But at least, unlike the others, Henry’s entertained me in the role he’s been given.

by bensix on Nov 22, 2011 6:33 PM EST up reply actions  

i agree

to an extent, im tired of the crapy heel bookin wwe gives these guys lately, they killed ADR’s heat like he was bullshit, i remember just a few months ago, the guy was geting hugee heat, then vinnie mac for some god forsaken reason thought it was a good idea to send cena out there to tell him to go back to taco bell, and then they send punk to tell him hes one dimensional and his promos suck, not to mention the loses he had against cena, losing a title just because they were insecure about ratings

and all that really pisses me off, but Mark Henry has been entertaining so far, are there better guys that could be in that position? absolutely, but that doesnt mean that henry sucks

and the reason mark henry is getting this push and pining guys like orton its because hes old, and hes loyal, and thats pretty much the thing wwe cares the most about, they wont push guys like ADR because they are new to the company, they dont know if they can trust em, they are afraid of making a guy like ADR pin john cena and thenhaving him going to TNA, they want this guys to “pay their dues” and well, that takes a lot of years by wwe standards and chances are, guys like ADR arent even gonna be around when that time comes because they dont need that bullcrap

by chaggo on Nov 22, 2011 10:24 PM EST up reply actions  

But the "paying dues" mentality is retarded in the first place.

If loyalty was indicative of how hard a guy should be pushed. WWE should’ve jobbed out Brock Lesnar to Bob Holly and Al Snow upon his debut.

How about instead of pushing guys like Kane and Mark Henry just because they’ve been with the company forever, WWE pushes the guys who are the best workers and the best promos? It wouldn’t be that hard, and the matches would actually be good.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 12:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Henry is not the reason ratings went up.

The NBA decided to go on strike this year, leaving a large chunk of the 18-49 demographic without a rigged sport featuring over the top 300 lbs yahoos to watch. They decided to give Smackdown a chance because of that.

Sure, there’s probably a small number of people who are tuning in because they like watching a dominant heel champion kick ass and take names, but Vince McMahon could’ve booked anyone to be a dominant heel champion who kicks ass and takes names, there’s nothing Henry does as an asskicker, wrestler, or a promo that Sheamus, Wade Barrett, Alberto Del Rio, Big Show, Jack Swagger, Luke Gallows (if he wasn’t fired), of Chris Masters (if he wasn’t fired) couldn’t do better if they were given the exact same push.

Hell, the fact that people demand only a hoss can be a dominant champion is part of the problem. Lots of moderately sized and small guys could be booked dominantly if Vince McMahon ever got over his “size” boner. Bryan Danielson became the highest grossing indie star ever with that character.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 6:20 PM EST up reply actions  

I was exaggerating a point for comedic effect.

But the NBA thing still holds true, 18-49 year olds who would be watching the NBA are now giving Smackdown a chance simply because they share a similar timeslot.

And if I’m not mistaken, Mark Henry squashed Rey Mysterio while Rey was champion, and was in Undertaker’s only bad Wresltemania match this decade. It’d be one thing to do stuff like that in the 90’s, but Undertaker tore the house down at every other Wrestlemania he was at except when he faced Henry, who is terrible, and Kane, who is also terrible.

Look at the amount of chances Henry has had.

1996 – Signs the most lucrative contract in WWE history, fails to even place in single digits at the Olympics.

1998 – Flattens the Rock of all people in five minutes on the Judgment Day PPV.

2002 – Wins the Arnold Strongman Classic, pushed huge.

2003 – Huge programs with Shawn Michaels and Goldberg, gets injured.

2006 – PPV main event against Kurt Angle, the match sucked, and for some reason people blamed it on Angle. Wrestlemania match against Undertaker, Undertaker’s worst Mania match of the decade. Pins the WHC Rey Mysterio clean as a sheet, Rey only ever beat Henry via DQ.

2007 – PPV main event against Undertaker, it was really bad.

2008 – ECW Title Reign.

2009 – Clean win over Randy Orton.

Does that list indicate a man who hasn’t received enough chances to get over?

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 6:53 PM EST up reply actions  

Henry won the belt in September, NBA usually starts in November.
These are facts.

My porn name is HogOfHawkness

by HeartOfHawkness on Nov 22, 2011 7:48 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

He did not sign the most lucrative deal in WWE history

In fact Big Show had a better deal than Henry and Bret Hart as well. Every single one of these so called pushes led to no where because Vince pulled the rug from under Henry whenever he started rolling. I could make a similar list for several wrestlers including Cody Rhodes, Jack Swagger and others. Lastly, stop punishing Henry because his agent was able to get that deal for him. Its called leverage and negotiating. Who made the choice to rush Henry to the main roster after only a few months training? Hmmmm

So much more goes on behind the scenes than the so called evidence you are using to prove your point.

Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...

by Major on Nov 22, 2011 8:33 PM EST up reply actions  

This isn't what I was talking about.

Henry isn’t the most well paid guy in WWE history, but the thing that separates Henry’s contract from other lucrative contracts. Henry got a 10 year contract that paid over one million dollars a year in base pay from his debut, regardless of what he did for the company. No one else has earned base pay like that while working for the WWE, partially because while other guys had to work for years on the undercard to earn their high figures, and prove themselves as draws, Henry got it from his debut.

Even if Big Show’s contract was slightly larger, Show hasn’t been a tenured WWE employee as long as Henry, and Show was actually a draw when WWE signed him. Henry was a guy who lost the Olympics, badly.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 9:00 PM EST up reply actions  

So what?

You blame Henry because Vince decided to give a million bucks not to go to WCW and not to train another four years fro the Olympics? Why don’t you get that the contract has nothing to do with Henry at all. Are you saying he’s lazy? Are you saying something was given to him? Well you don’t get the Olympics by being lazy and when WWE writers call you nigger to your face in front of your peers and the owner clowns you every chance he gets and yet Henry stuck it out because he loves wrestling.

Mark Henry wasn’t given a damn thing. BTW Brock Lesnar signed a deal that gave a signing bonus rumored to be over 5 million dollars. Funny that Lesnar was a gifted wrestler and was given the top spot and darted out of wrestling meanwhile for 15 years Mark Henry stuck with it while experiencing more BS than anyone one talent in WWE history.

Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...

by Major on Nov 22, 2011 9:10 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Being in terrible angles while getting repeated pushes and more base pay than anyone else in the roster despite being terrible in the ring and average on the mic isn’t “putting up with more BS than anyone one talent in WWE history.” Hell, anyone else would kill for the opportunities WWE gave Henry.

Anyone in WWE who wasn’t given a huge contract up front and didn’t have multiple chances to get themselves over only to fail the push themselves rather than having their heat killed because Vince McMahon doesn’t like them had to put up with more than Henry. Hell, the only guys who’ve had it easier than Henry I can think of in WWE are Undertaker, Brock Lesnar, and Big Show, and those guys are actually good.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 10:06 PM EST up reply actions  

OK thats fine

Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...

by Major on Nov 22, 2011 10:09 PM EST up reply actions  

So you obviously did not see the match with the Rock. Rock dominated for five minutes and Henry won on a fluke.

The Goldberg match was really good. He got injured, it happens.

The Rey series was great, and the Taker match was good. Saying its Taker’s worst Mania match this decade is hardly a dig.

Once again you’re wrong.

The ECW title reign was good and he got over, whats your point?

Again he got over. Ratings are up and the matches are good.

Henry is a great wrestler who has good matches more often than not. Its pathetic to see how bad Cageside Seats has sunk that they let a person like you write for the site. I’m embarrassed to be a founding member.

by Dr.Victator on Nov 25, 2011 8:16 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, Henry was so over WWECW got taken off TV in under two years.

Sure, Henry’s Rey Mysterio matches were less embarassing than Henry’s matches with other wrestlers, but by Rey Mysterio standards, those matches were probably the worst of his career. Not to mention that Henry won all his matches with Rey Rey clean while Rey was World Champion, except that one match where Rey won via DQ.

The Taker match was terrible, Taker worked his ass off to try and have a decent match, but even Taker’s match with Ric Flair, who hadn’t seen steady ring action in two years, was by far a better match.

Henry has an incredibly limited offense, especially for a guy who’s been a wrestler for almost two decades. Henry’s cardio is the worst in WWE today, and his flexibility is nonexistent; Henry can’t even perform a big boot because of how inflexible he is, the move every other big immobile hoss can easily perform is beyond Henry’s reach.

Henry is terrible, and the only reason anyone is saying otherwise is as blatant history revisionism.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 11:21 AM EST up reply actions  

lmao
Yeah, Henry was so over WWECW got taken off TV in under two years.

are you seriously trying to blame the demise of WWECW on Mark Henry?

Maslow's theory of higher needs does not apply to Patrick Willis. He only has two needs: tackling people and finding people to tackle.

by 49erLou on Nov 25, 2011 2:17 PM EST up reply actions  

No,

but if Henry was such a draw, the brand he was made champion on wouldn’t have had it’s plug pulled less than two years after he got the belt.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 3:00 PM EST up reply actions  

So because the new ECW was nothing like the old ECW

and was filled with a bunch of guys just getting their feet wet and a few guys like William Regal, Christian and Mark Henry that are good wrestlers but never really huge draws that could carry a program is why a reason why Mark Henry was a failure and he was the sole reason why ECW was finally killed off.

Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Jack Butler, Greg Lloyd, Andy Russell, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene, Curtis Martin, Willie Roaf, Andre Reed and Jerry Kramer
"YOU ARE A FACTORY OF SADNESS" Angry Browns fan
Canal Chronicles resident Steelers Fan

by WVPiratesfan on Nov 26, 2011 3:00 PM EST up reply actions  

If Mark Henry was any good,

people would’ve tuned in to watch ECW, and it wouldn’t have died a quick death following Henry getting the belt. Henry isn’t a draw in any way, even nowadays. Look at the buyrates and live gates for the PPV’s Henry’s main evented this year:

Night of Champions, when Henry won the title – 161,000 buys worldwide, 11,000 attended

Hell in a Cell, Henry’s first title defense – 180,000 buys worldwide, 9,400 attended

Vengeance, Henry vs. Big Show – 142,000 buys worldwide, 8,000 attended

These are horrifically bad numbers, sure, you can blame some of it on the crowd despising Cena, but the WWE fans hated Cena back in 2005 and 2006, but because Batista and DX were big hits, buyrates were really good. Henry doesn’t bring that.

Henry’s also easily the worst wrestler WWE’s given any WWE world title since Khali. Henry’s irredeemably slow and lethargic in the ring, and the only mainstream wrestler I’ve ever seen who has to perform long restholds in ten minute matches. Henry’s legs are so inflexible he can’t even perform the big boot, the most basic maneuver in wrestling, and he’s so heavy he can’t even help most of his opponents lift his fat ass of the ground. Henry botched taking Wade Barrett’s Wasteland for Christ’s sake.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 26, 2011 9:55 PM EST up reply actions  

They killed ECW when Christian was the champ

you also have to factory in the economy when you talk about buy rates and people attending. Some people that would normally buy a PPV or attend one just don’t have the money to.

Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Jack Butler, Greg Lloyd, Andy Russell, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene, Curtis Martin, Willie Roaf, Andre Reed and Jerry Kramer
"YOU ARE A FACTORY OF SADNESS" Angry Browns fan
Canal Chronicles resident Steelers Fan

by WVPiratesfan on Nov 28, 2011 10:16 AM EST up reply actions  

That wasn't what I was talking about.

I was saying that if Mark Henry was a benefit to ECW after he became champion, he would’ve increased the TV ratings, or the ECW/Smackdown taping gates would’ve been higher, it never happened. It doesn’t matter if Christian was champion when they pulled the plug on ECW or not. What mattered was that Henry was champion less than two years before ECW’s death, and he did nothing to stave off its death. It wasn’t the economy that kept ECW’s ratings in the toilet, most of the people who were actually effected by that didn’t have cable even before the recession hit.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 28, 2011 11:19 AM EST up reply actions  

Christian did even less

because they killed the show off when he was Champ. What about Jack Swagger, he was the ECW champ once did he kill the show or does that not fit into your narritive that Mark Henry is the worst champion since David Arquette.

Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Jack Butler, Greg Lloyd, Andy Russell, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene, Curtis Martin, Willie Roaf, Andre Reed and Jerry Kramer
"YOU ARE A FACTORY OF SADNESS" Angry Browns fan
Canal Chronicles resident Steelers Fan

by WVPiratesfan on Nov 28, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions  

I never said Mark Henry was the worst champion ever.

There have been plenty of title reigns that were booked worse, hell the bookers actually have done a remarkable job of covering Henry’s weaknesses. My beef with the Mark Henry push is that he doesn’t deserve it at all because he’s a bad wrestler, a mediocre promo, and not a draw in any way.

Sure, there are guys who are worse wrestlers than Henry, though there aren’t many of them, and there are even guys who were worse draws when pushed to the main event, but just because he’s not the worst wrestler or worse draw ever doesn’t excuse the fact that he’s not a draw at all, and his matches are really bad.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 28, 2011 1:31 PM EST up reply actions  

you

He knows the guy with the bandage on his ass is going no were. Were you going fucking no were

by Elstriko on Nov 22, 2011 9:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

You really should do some fan post or such. Usually have a well thought out opinion

He knows the guy with the bandage on his ass is going no were. Were you going fucking no were

by Elstriko on Nov 22, 2011 9:36 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Thank you…I’m definitely going to do something interesting to read for everyone.

Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...

by Major on Nov 22, 2011 9:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Looking forward to it.

And it will be fronted.

Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.

by Geno Mrosko on Nov 22, 2011 9:54 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL

Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...

by Major on Nov 22, 2011 10:08 PM EST up reply actions  

I better make this good then

Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...

by Major on Nov 22, 2011 10:19 PM EST up reply actions  

WWE loves to give the heel some sort of "illegal" career threatening move

With Mark Henry, it is the chair to the ankle.
With Orton, it was the punt to the head.
With Edge, it was the “con-chair-to”.

Writers noticed that the fans react when the heel is trying to end people’s careers.

by djfivenine on Nov 22, 2011 6:17 PM EST reply actions  

Uh?

Mark Henry arguably had the second best match of the night at SummerSlam. He’s been having good to great matches for at least three years now. He’s a hoss who actually can impose his physical presence rather than some of these stiffs who have no idea how to manipulate their body language. Watch Mason Ryan and then watch Mark Henry and then tell me with a straight face that they’re the same. You’d be wrong, dead wrong.

The truth is Henry has been underrated for a good long time. He was saddled with terrible gimmicks during the Attitude Era in an attempt to make him quit, and he stuck around and tried to get better. He lost a buttload of weight at one point and came back up through OVW like a relative toothpick with an arsenal of quicker moves, but then bulked up because WWE ASKED him to do a bodybuilding competition. The reason it took so many tries to get him over was because they gave up on him after too short or put him in racially insensitive angles (putting his stank on Trish Stratus? The Silverback? REALLY?).

When htey finally got behind him in ECW, he INSTANTLY became one of the brightest spots on the show. When he beat Randy Orton on that RAW when he first got traded over, the fans went batshit for him, and yet his push was stalled before it began.

You’re wrong. Dead wrong. Just because you don’t like Mark Henry doesn’t make his push not valid.

by Thomas Holzerman on Nov 22, 2011 6:58 PM EST reply actions  

I saw this years Summerslam

Mark Henry’s match with Sheamus was probably the fifth best match on the card, if I’m being generous. Hell, the card only had six matches to begin with.

The only card I can ever remember where the Mark Henry match was even in contention for “second best on the card” was at this years Vengeance PPV, and the only reason the match was even good was because of Big Show. Show had all the interesting offense in the match, and took the biggest bump, Mark Henry laid on Big Shows leg for five minutes. I’d even be skeptical of calling it the second best match of the night, as Air Boom had a better match that went longer with a decently hot crowd to open the show, and Orton/Rhodes was probably the best wrestling match of the night if you ignore the fact that the crowd didn’t buy Rhodes would win for a second. Being one of three contenders for “second best match of the night” on a forgettable B-Show doesn’t make you good.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 7:13 PM EST up reply actions  

You apparently didn’t watch it the same way that most other people whose opinions I respect on the matter did, because everyone I know loved that match.

by Thomas Holzerman on Nov 22, 2011 7:25 PM EST up reply actions  

yep. Henry has been awesome this year. The guy is seriously one of the best things in the WWE right now. This push should have happened back in 2006.

by jjhh05 on Nov 22, 2011 7:33 PM EST up reply actions  

The push did happen in 2006.

If I’m not mistaken, it was one of the worst main event runs WWE has ever seen.

Mark Henry had bad matches with Kurt Angle, Undertaker, and Rey Mysterio all in one year, he had one passable match with Rey, but by Rey standards, “passable” is pedestrian. For anybody else, they’d probably get fired after a run that bad, but because Vince McMahon loves big wrestlers, Henry got four more huge pushes after 2006.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 2:00 PM EST up reply actions  

I think Mark Henry is one of the best things going for WWE right now.

Also, Henry won the HWC in September and Smackdown ratings have seen an obvious increase ever since which makes your point about the NBA strike being responsible for this ridiculous considering the NBA was scheduled to start in November and RAW has not seen the same increase in ratings. That alone makes it seem like you are really grasping at straws in order to validate your personal opinions as undeniable facts.

Do you know DashingRachel?

My porn name is HogOfHawkness

by HeartOfHawkness on Nov 22, 2011 7:27 PM EST reply actions  

Here is something as well...

WWe loves kowtowing to different racial lines… see Del Rio in Mexico. In a sense with the WWE title they get themselves locked into different champs as suits them. They use the title as a prop to help get themselves more money based on where they go.

The WHT is a bit different. You want to bag on Henry & Kane… Kane ended up have a good run last year. Better than Mysterio was having. They both elevated themselves. We as fans like being pleasantly surprised.. and when Miz got the belt and then held on to it for a good run, he was being rewarded for taking the ball & running with it. You didn’t bag on Christian.. he says he’s “Captain Charisma”.. and he’s not.. the guy is boring & stale & only got the belt because it worked with Edge retiring. He didn’t elevate that belt.. instead he tried to become Edge Jr.. even taking his spear & theatrics. Christian is growing on me some in recent months.. but he’s just not interesting on the whole. Somehow someone decided to give Henry a chance.. and he’s taking the ball & running.. his promos have improved, his matches are better suited for him. This all started w/ Henry getting beat down for no reason.. just that he was there for Show to smack around. Henry flipped a switch.. and I think it helps his persona that he’s different in his color.. being black helps him. We are all visual people.. Henry stands out visually from the pack.. when he gets that nastiness going.. I think it works on the prominently white fans the WWe has. I think he really does scare the shit out of a lot of them.. and his race & size & mean streak that comes across on tv help him. When his song says “someone’s about to get their ass kicked” people believe it. Not just cuz what he did in the ring, I think the stereotypical black man has something to do with it too. And he’s making it work. Power to him… I’m glad he’s doing well. Your using the Tebow argument.. that eventually his limitations will come to light & that he’ll fail.. but look at it this way.. we aren’t getting the normal Randy Orton run as per usual on SD. And huge ups to Orton for helping build up the talent.. different story. This is refreshing & just enjoy it. WWe will eventually F it up.

by Rawuncutnxrated on Nov 22, 2011 7:29 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

I never said Christian elevated the belt.

Both Christian reigns were terrible, and did a lot to damage the titles reputation, but they were both vastly superior to the Mark Henry, Miz, and Kane reigns because the Christian matches were really good, and the Henry/Miz/Kane matches suck.

No matter how badly booked a title reign is, if the matches were good, I’m more forgiving. The only acceptable reason for matches as bad as Kane, Miz, and Mark Henry have been putting on is if they’re draws, and none of those guys draw jack.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 9:14 PM EST up reply actions  

I didn’t say you did.. I was just point out how a supposed good worker like Christian.. and a guy everyone said was deserving. I think Henry has done more than Christian. And was simply comparing them both.. as I think their situations could warrant that comparison for this argument.

How can you say that none of them draw jack… let me clue you in.. back when Rock was in his prime you sold matches.. now.. they sell WWe, not matches or competitors. It almost doesn’t matter so much who is champ, the fans just want to see WWe.. hell on Raw they almost never tell us the matches or even the Main Event for the following week.. which sucks because they spend the 1st 20 minutes of every episode lazily booking it then. The only things planned out are the titles.. and that’s based on some crappy reasons.. see Del Rio w/ the Mexican tour. The draw isn’t house shows anymore.. its ratings.. and your argument about the NBA is logical but it is not definitive. Lets be honest.. the ratings really haven’t moved for Raw or SD in years. You get a push here or a fall there.. but on the whole.. nothing changes. Henry is refreshing.. he’s not just the next white man to carry the belt that follows every single formula. He’s got a gripe, he’s going out & whippin’ ass, and he’s got a pretty good catch phrase.. which again, most people in WWe do not have. They are all looking for it. What’s Morrison’s? What is Ziggler’s? Hell, Orton doesn’t even have one. Those phrases help fans cheer, or something to help separate someone from the pack. I hate Ryder & anything he’s doing, but he came up w/ a phrase, fans chant it, they are into him.. and he didn’t wait for creative to give it to him. I almost think that Show hit Henry for real during that run in a long while back.. cuz Henry hit a switch & was like.. f*ck this.. I ain’t gettin’ punked out again.. and then went out & probably started demanding that creative do something with him where he’s not some b*tch. Good for him.. like JR said, the younger guys need to be hungrier.. that’s not just a slogan.. back in the old days they were hungry.. literally.. so they worked harder at building themselves.. cuz it would mean more money. Nash likes to take credit for the “guaranteed contracts” but maybe that help ruin wresting.. cuz none wrestlers get pushed & never work at things to get better.. so we get crap on tv. Henry is finally working at building himself.. and its working. Fans buy him as a legit badass that probably scares most of the white crowds.. and eventually he’s going to get his ass beat & people will love it.. but it won’t be Show or Kane that does it… I think it’ll be Bryan.. and when he does, he’ll be elevated to the moon cuz of what a badass Henry has been.

by Rawuncutnxrated on Nov 22, 2011 9:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeesh

Mark Henry has delivered good promos, good matches, and has mostly been booked pretty well. I’m not alone in thinking he is one of the best things about wrestling at the moment.

You certainly are putting a lot of effort into this anti-Henry thing. It’s quite a feat to have written so much in the article and in the comments without making a single good point.

by Jon Knapik on Nov 22, 2011 7:50 PM EST reply actions  

Mark Henry has delivered decent, but not memorable promos, but his matches utterly suck.

Henry’s matches have always been terrible. This is a guy who’s worked programs with Shawn Michaels, Undertaker, Kurt Angle, Rey Mysterio, Randy Orton, and the Rock at the peak of their careers, yet Henry has almost continuously stunk up the buliding every night.

I can name two Mark Henry matches that were good, but they certainly weren’t great. One was with Rey Mysterio, who could have a * match with a sandbag, and the other was with Big Show. Both matches involved his opponents doing all the work, particularly the Big Show match, where Show did all the heavy cardio, performed all the interesting moves, and took the biggest bumps, yet for some reason people use that match as evidence on how awesome Henry is.

For a guy who’s been in so many big matches against so many great workers, not to mention the fact that he’s been given almost two decades to perfect his style, you’d expect him to have at least a * match every time he goes out there for a non-squash match. I don’ t expect a wrestler to be able to deliver matches on Rey Mysterio’s standards by default to be in the main event, but I at least expect solid action along the lines of guys like John Cena and Randy Orton for them to be an acceptable main eventer for a major promotion. Henry doesn’t cut the mustard.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 9:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Sorry, I meant to write “three stars” with three asterisk’s, but it was posted as just a single asterisk for some reason.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 22, 2011 9:51 PM EST up reply actions  

I read where you wrote this same exact thing above, and I completely disagree. He’s no Shawn Michaels, but he has been in some great matches this year. Against Randy Orton at Hell In the Cell, Henry was great. I can understand not being a fan, but you’re way off in your assessment of his talent.

I always hated the guy in the past, but I have to give credit where it is due – he’s one of the best things about wrestling right now. You should consider giving him his due credit as well.

by Jon Knapik on Nov 22, 2011 10:13 PM EST up reply actions  

That Cell match.. that was a good one. Orton worked his ass off, but Henry deserves credit as well. Great point.

by Rawuncutnxrated on Nov 22, 2011 10:31 PM EST up reply actions  

I just want to say the discussion is great.

I appreciate you guys being able to go back and forth on a topic without killing each other.

As for Henry, I feel like he’s been one of the best things in all of pro wrestling over the past three months. It’s only lately that his matches have taken a hit and that’s only with Big Show because, admittedly enough, there’s only so much they can do together. And even that seems harsh, considering how well they’ve done with each other.

The ratings on Friday night’s for Smackdown have been damn good and while we can’t say for sure that they’re all because of Henry, the fact is they turned right around the same time he was given the championship. That counts for plenty.

I’m a mark for Henry, though, admittedly enough.

Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.

by Geno Mrosko on Nov 22, 2011 7:55 PM EST reply actions  

Back in the summer I was dreading the rumored Mark Henry push. I have rarely ever looked forward to watching a Mark Henry match. So I understand where the main focus of this anti-Henry rant is coming from. I would much rather see the huge push go to someone with much more of a future in WWE like Barrett or Ziggler, etc.

But the bottom line is that they have done a good job of finally putting Henry into a position to help some babyfaces like Bryan get over. If the Henry push ends without anybody relatively fresh being elevated (besides Henry) then I agree the whole thing was a huge waste of time. But as much as it pains me to watch the guy wrestle, I think they have done a good job of making it so that beating him for the title will probably be very meaningful and a big deal.

I imagine the Henry title reign will be over before Wrestlemania because I don’t see Henry getting one of the main event matches on that show. Let’s see what they can come up with for him between now and then.

by Kanenite on Nov 22, 2011 8:31 PM EST reply actions  

I agree with the author. The idea of watching a Mark Henry match makes me not want to turn on my TV. He is not good in the ring and about the same on the mic. He has finally been booked well but the decade worth of bad memories he has provided makes me not care.
I think the NBA strike is a bad excuse. To me the reason that SD has increased ratings is the absence of Vince and his micro management.
Your main theme of how the IWC has gone gaga over him, when a couple months ago they derided him every time he came on the screen is accurate. It’s like the hipster that makes fun of a a band yet buys there music and goes to the show.

by Scott Whitt on Nov 22, 2011 10:17 PM EST reply actions  

That analogy doesn't mesh very well

It’d be like people mocking a bad, then the bad changes their style of music, and people start liking them.

Mark Henry from a year ago, as a character, is the complete opposite of Mark Henry today.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 23, 2011 10:45 PM EST up reply actions  

How?

Mark Henry is still just as bad in the ring as he was back in 1998. Henry’s cardio is probably the worst in the WWE at the moment. Henry’s virtually impossible to lift for the people on the roster who don’t have superhuman strength, and unlike other big men who have enough spring in them to make it look like they’re being suplexed (i.e. Takeshi Morishima), Henry doesn’t have anywhere near that ability.

If any other wrestler in WWE got gassed out after five minutes, they’d be considered the worst guy in the company. Hell, Triple H is considered slow nowadays, and he just wrestled Undertaker at Wrestlemania in a match that went twice as long as Mark Henry’s Survivor Series match, while also managing to have a faster pace.

Sure, the way Henry is booked in 2011 is different than the way Henry was booked in 2010, even if it is the eighth or ninth time they’ve given a major push to Henry, but the way a guy is booked is not indicative of their abilities as a wrestler whatsoever. If it was, John Cena would be considered the best wrestler since Hulk Hogan, and Crimson would be considered the best wrestler not employed by WWE today.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 24, 2011 10:30 AM EST up reply actions  

The main point of his post was that it's silly that people who mocked Mark Henry in the past are now praising him

The character has changed; In just this year, he went from a generic face with nothing in particular going on, in terms both of story or personality, to a vengeful heel with an angry persona who is being booked as a monster, taking out other wrestlers left and right. Deriding people who didn’t like him a year ago, but are supporting him now because they didn’t like him in the past, but are supportive of him does not pan out logically. Mark Henry in 2010 is not the same character as Mark Henry in 2011.

By the same logic, it would be silly for people to root for the baseball prospect who just figured things out after toiling for years in the Minor Leagues, to like the band that sucked that changed their sound/style and reinvented themselves, to be interested in the girl who had a big nose, but just had a nose job and is not more attractive. To think a change of opinion after some kind of change is silly is, well, silly in and of itself.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 24, 2011 9:51 PM EST up reply actions  

2011 heel Henry is the exact same character as 2008 heel Henry, 2007 heel Henry, 2006 heel Henry, etc.

The only difference between the Henry of today, including matwork and mikework, is that Vince McMahon decided to book Henry to be the most dominant force WWE has seen from a heel since Brock Lesnar. Henry’s promos are still just as average as they were at any previous time period, and his matches are still unbelievably bad by main eventer standards, or even midcard standards. All the tricks that have been used to push Henry to the moon could’ve been used to push just about anyone else on the roster as the top heel to greater effect.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 11:13 AM EST up reply actions  

There is a difference, and you yourself just said so

Case closed.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 25, 2011 4:00 PM EST up reply actions  

It's the same character, he just happens to be booked differently.

That’s not a change that took any effort on Henry’s part, hence, no difference.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 7:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Mark Henry 2011 heel =/= Mark Henry anytime before

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 25, 2011 11:17 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

How is it impossible for you to see that it’s the exact same character and crappy wrestler as he was during every one of his previous heel runs? The only difference is that he’s booked to win more often, but the promos and matches are exactly the same as the ones he’d give at any other point in his career.

It’s not a new character.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 11:49 PM EST up reply actions  

No matter how many times you say it is, it doesn't change the fact that Mark Henry as presented currently is not the same as Mark Henry presented earlier in the year, or anytime before

You’ve already acknowledged this yourself.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 26, 2011 11:04 PM EST up reply actions  

That was never what was asked.

I acknowledged Henry was changed in the way he was presented, but we were debating on weather or not he’s a different character nowadays than he was during his previous heel pushes.

He isn’t, Henry’s promos and matches are exactly the same as they were in 2008, 2007, 2006, 2003, and whenever else WWE was stupid enough to push Henry as a top heel. Sure, they’ve changed the way they’ve booked him, but when the matches you’re in and the promos you cut are exactly the same as at any other point in your career, you’re still the same character, you’re just getting more screen-time and more victories.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 28, 2011 11:22 AM EST up reply actions  

You don’t have the first clue what you are talking about. Its difficult to not call you a moron and be done with it.

You really don’t get professional wrestling. You seem to think its ice skating and has some weird points system.

“Hmm this man did not do three flips and he worked a slower pace. Minus six points.”

by Dr.Victator on Nov 25, 2011 8:25 AM EST up reply actions  

When in the hell have I ever said flips are what make a match good.

I hate spotmonkeys. My two favorite match ever is a psychology heavy technical match involving two enormous hosses hossing off against each other (Jumbo Tsuruta vs. Billy Robinson), and a match involving one of my least favorite wrestlers ever facing off against one of the least smooth guys on the roster (John Cena vs. CM Punk).

Henry not being a flippido guy with a lot of offensive maneuvers and 60 finishers isn’t what makes him a shitty wrestler. Henry’s a shitty wrestler because he has the worst cardiovascular conditioning of anybody in the WWE. It’s one thing to use restholds in 20 to 30 minute matches, but Henry can’t go five minutes without having to utilize a long resthold. Henry doesn’t even have the decency to drop repeated elbows or legdrops on the limb of his opponent he’s targeting, he just flops down and lays on their limbs for five minutes while his opponents perform all the work. That’s why Henry sucks.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 11:08 AM EST up reply actions  

I like it because it's something new

what do people always say killed WCW, the lack of new storylines, the refusal to push new stars, the constant rehashing of the nWo. Now when the WWE is pushing a new star they get killed for it. It’s a trend I’ve seen with the IWC they always want new talent pushed, but only in the way they want and if it isn’t who they want or how they want either he sucks or the storyline sucks and there is no changing their mind.

Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Jack Butler, Greg Lloyd, Andy Russell, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene, Curtis Martin, Willie Roaf, Andre Reed and Jerry Kramer
"YOU ARE A FACTORY OF SADNESS" Angry Browns fan
Canal Chronicles resident Steelers Fan

by WVPiratesfan on Nov 22, 2011 11:54 PM EST reply actions  

WCW died because it put on shitty shows, not because it never tried anything new.

Hell, a lot of concepts WCW tried were incredibly new, and they should’ve never been done in the first place.

“Let’s have shows with nothing but promos!”

“Let’s have the conniving heel get screwed out of beating the babyface clean! (Starrcade ’97)”

“Let’s give Ultimate Warrior magic powers!”

“Let’s give MONGO a stay in the Horseman!”

“Let’s work those marks on the internet!”

If you can put on a show that does nothing but high quality wrestling with mangagers who can cut fantastic promos and charismatic wrestlers, it won’t matter if all your storylines are ripoffs if they’re well executed. WWE just hasn’t been executing good storylines, so nobody wants to watch them.

Also, what’s new and different about giving a huge push to a guy who’s already recieved damn near a dozen huge pushes that have all bombed previously?

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 10:45 AM EST up reply actions  

And how did they bomb exactly?

He was over in 03.

He was over in 06.

He was over in 08.

Shit he was over in 98 as a midcard act.

So really when did he bomb?

Because the president of Davey Richards fan club doesn’t like him?

by Dr.Victator on Nov 25, 2011 8:27 AM EST up reply actions  

Henry bombed in 03, 06, 08, and 98 because all his matches were really bad despite working with the best wrestlers in the company, he never made any money for anybody, never sold any merchandise, never sold any PPV’s, and never got pops that would be indicitive of a main event player. Henry’s ‘06 runs is one of the worst main event runs I’ve ever seen anyone perform, he stunk up the building when facing Kurt Angle, Rey Mysterio, and even stunk up Undertaker’s Wrestlemania match, I didn’t even think it was possible to do all those things at once.

Sure, Henry’s a better promo than Davey Richards, but it’s not like the difference between Rock and Ken Patera, Henry’s just good enough a promo to not embarrass himself, but not good enough to ever say anything memorable. Henry’s certainly not a good enough promo to justify the fact that he has the worst cardio on the roster, and can’t even go 10 minutes without filling his match with restholds.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Let's be honest here

While I love the Mark Henry push, and he’s had some good matches since moving up to the championship scene over the summer, there wasn’t anyone else to push. Anyone you really could have thought to push has already been damaged to a point to where they wouldn’t be credible.

Sheamus: now face
Barrett: just now being built back up after repeated Cena burials
Ziggler: He had his chance at the beginning of the year, and you see where that got him. He’s just recently turned it back around with the help of Ryder’s youtube show.
Swagger: Buried by the whole Michael Cole fiasco
ADR: Buried by Cena
Miz: Same

Now…what faces other than Orton, Punk and Cena are championship worthy? Anyone….anyone? Sheesh, had Edge not been forced to retire, we might not even be at this point.

Mark Henry is the only legit heel that doesn’t have the taint of a Cena or Orton burial on him in recent history, and beating Orton like he did only further legitimized his status. Until WWE starts pushing the heels of the roster as something more than chickens—- Cena fodder, we’ll be right back here complaining after WM about the same thing.

'Bama fan since birth, Niners Faithful & Hawks fan since '86, Braves fan since '90

It's the sport of kings, better than diamond rings....football.
Roll Tide Roll!
Go NIners!

by ronniemac03 on Nov 23, 2011 4:35 AM EST reply actions  

But it didn't have to be that way.

WWE could’ve chose to strap a rocket to Sheamus, Barrett, Ziggler, ADR, Swagger, or a lot of guys other than Henry. Vince McMahon just chose to pick Henry because of his size fetish, and because of his insane theory that the guys who’ve been with the company forever despite never drawing and never having good matches deserve a place above guys who could have a future.

Literally the exact same thing happened with Kane last year, and for some reason, people still haven’t caught on.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 10:32 AM EST up reply actions  

That leads me back to the "credibility" issue

All those guys you mentioned needed (Swagger and ADR still need) a major rebuild before you can just throw them into the title picture. ADR was champ mainly for the tour through Mexico, and not much more. If they really wanted to push him, he would have won the WHC after Edge retired, and not Christian. Champions, above all else and especially in these days, have to be credible. ADR wasn’t a champion so much as he was a beltholder, and the same thing goes for Christian. Barrett, Ziggler and Cody seem to be being groomed as the next wave of heel champions, but will they be given the opportunity to succeed when faced with the merchandise pushing, kid money magnet that is SuperCena? As long as Cena continues to play his current persona, the WWE roster will continue to be sucked into a black hole, because he is booked to be superior to anyone that dares challenge him. This whole Rock thing screams for a Cena heel turn, but they’re afraid to pull the trigger, and it’s their own fault, because Cena has become the crutch that WWE is scared to let go of and actually build a stronger roster.

'Bama fan since birth, Niners Faithful & Hawks fan since '86, Braves fan since '90

It's the sport of kings, better than diamond rings....football.
Roll Tide Roll!
Go NIners!

by ronniemac03 on Nov 23, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions  

But your missing the point.

Vince McMahon should’ve pushed Del Rio, Barrett, Rhodes, Ziggler, and Sheamus.

Vince McMahon shouldn’t have pushed Mark Henry.

Vince McMahon could’ve done both those things at once, it wasn’t an either/or scenario.

WWE didn’t have to kill those guys credibility. WWE didn’t have to push Mark Henry above all those people who have talent, youth, and a future. Just because one stupid decision they made is less stupid than their other stupid decision doesn’t justify the stupid decision.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 12:23 PM EST up reply actions  

And you're missing the point

Mark Henry as WHC is the best thing for business right now, no matter what you think of him or his past failures. He is the only full time man on the current roster that hasn’t been sucked into the black hole that is John Cena. He is the perfect monster heel (of which WWE has none of) to properly build a face up to main event status (Wrestling 101). Del Rio just had the WWE title, and shit, who really cared that he had it? You knew he wasn’t going to hold it long, and nobody wanted or bothered to invest in him at all.

BTW, all those guys you mentioned were pushed…with the exception of Ziggler, all were fed to Cena.

'Bama fan since birth, Niners Faithful & Hawks fan since '86, Braves fan since '90

It's the sport of kings, better than diamond rings....football.
Roll Tide Roll!
Go NIners!

by ronniemac03 on Nov 23, 2011 3:59 PM EST up reply actions  

Wasn’t Henry a face and they suddenly turned him heel for this run? I think it happened at the draft. I agree with Asterisk that it should/could have been done with someone else. You could have done the same thing with Brodius Clay and had the same results. Hey man that one of the things he would have done when he took over TNA was to book a monster heel. It always works if you do it right but we all now that the WWE almost does nothing right as of late.
The only reason Henry wasn’t fed to Cena was he stunk and was a babyface. I think the mismanagement on the Nexxus angle ruined Barrett more than anything. Then they stuck him with the Corre, even worse.

by Scott Whitt on Nov 23, 2011 6:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Clay has that the taint of the Edge saga on him where he was ADR's lackey till he was sent back down.

It would have been different had he just been brought up and booked straightaway as a monster. Honestly, I can’t remember the last time a rookie came in with anything close to a instant main event push…not since Brock, I think. It’s a dang shame. I agree that if WWE were booking for the long term instead of booking to feed the SuperCena and pop a rating, Mark Henry doesn’t get this opportunity. But don’t hate on the man because when given this chance, he’s succeeding with it.

'Bama fan since birth, Niners Faithful & Hawks fan since '86, Braves fan since '90

It's the sport of kings, better than diamond rings....football.
Roll Tide Roll!
Go NIners!

by ronniemac03 on Nov 23, 2011 6:50 PM EST up reply actions  

How is Henry suceeding though?

All the work that’s being done is by the bookers, and Henry’s opponents, who have been busting their asses to cover up Henry’s weaknesses.

Henry’s promos are exactly the same as the promos he was cutting during his last major heel pushes. Henry’s matches are still just as bad as they were at any point in his career. PPV buyrates are still in the gutter. Smackdown ratings are a little higher, but only because of the NBA strike.

Henry shouldn’t get credit for this, Henry’s just a guy with a lot of protection. I understand the less seasoned fans buying into this somewhat, they’ve never seen these tricks before, even if fans have started to turn on the reign after that horrendous Big Show match at Survivor Series: but if you’ve been watching wrestling for any lengthy period of time, you should easily be able to figure out that Henry completely sucks in the ring, and is benefiting from a large amount of protection that could be used to push literally anyone else to better results.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 10:46 PM EST up reply actions  

He's succeeding because he's credible.

He isn’t tainted with the stench of being buried. I’ve admitted that what you see in ring now isn’t much different from his moveset over the years. However, his promos are believable because he’s credible. I’ve admitted that there are better in-ring workers that could have, in a perfect world, gotten this opportunity. Truth be told, the bookers aren’t doing anything special, if anything they’re for once letting the story flow naturally. It’s not being overbooked. It’s simple and easy to follow. You keep pointing at ratings like the NBA really has an impact of what SD’s ratings are, when that isn’t the case. PPV rates suck because Raw is a Cena-centered black hole and WWE has been afraid to step outside their comfort zone for a long time. Had WWE been on point, Mark would still be a gatekeeper to the main event, but not in it.

'Bama fan since birth, Niners Faithful & Hawks fan since '86, Braves fan since '90

It's the sport of kings, better than diamond rings....football.
Roll Tide Roll!
Go NIners!

by ronniemac03 on Nov 24, 2011 1:34 AM EST up reply actions  

So Henry's succeeding because of what the bookers did for him?

That’s not succeeding. Succeeding means that you live up to the level you’ve being pushed, not that you’re getting pushed. Saying Mark Henry is succeeding nowadays because he’s getting a sustained push and is winning a lot of matches is like saying that Kane had a great title reign last year because he got a sustained push and won a lot of matches.

Not to mention, how is “RAW is a Cena-centered black hole” a valid excuse for pushing the worst worker in the company to the moon on the show Cena isn’t on. How about WWE pushes one of the other Smackdown guys to the moon, and stop feeding their guys to Cena on RAW before they can sustain their heat? One bad decision doesn’t excuse a less bad decision.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 24, 2011 10:58 AM EST up reply actions  

It wouldn’t have worked because Clay is not as good as Henry is. Not many guys are.

by Dr.Victator on Nov 25, 2011 8:30 AM EST up reply actions  

The only guys who I can think of who might be worse than Henry are Mason Ryan, A-Ri, Ezekiel Jackson, and David Otunga, and it’s not by much.

Even then, Henry still has the worst cardio of anyone on the roster, including those four guys I mentioned previously. Henry’s also extraordinarily limited as far as mobility goes, he can’t bend his legs out in front of his body to perform a big boot, and has to perform long restholds even in matches that don’t last 10 minutes.

Sure, the bookers have done an extraordinary amount of work to disguise these weaknesses, but the things they’ve done to hide those weaknesses would’ve worked much better if they had someone with an actual future perform those things. Imagine how over Alberto Del Rio would be nowadays if WWE had him take out every giant on the roster, squash his opponents in minutes, and superplex Big Show, imagine if Wade Barrett got to do what Mark Henry is doing now instead of being forced to command yet another failed stable and job at Wrestlemania in seconds.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 10:51 AM EST up reply actions  

You’re full of shit. I mean you don’t even have an argument for why he is bad. You just randomly throw out terms like moves and cardio.

Late 80’s Andre the Giant was a fucking awesome wrestler and by the end he could only do headbutts. But he knew when to do it and why. He had charisma and projected an aura of invincibility.

Henry does the same thing.

Henry is far better than Wade Barrett. Y

Wrestling is more than moves.

by Dr.Victator on Nov 25, 2011 11:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Cardio is the single most important part of wrestling.

Even people with virtually no athletic ability can have great matches if they keep good cardio conditioning (i.e. CM Punk), not gassing out is the difference between a great wrestler (Steiner Brother’s Scott Steiner), and the worst worker in the company (WWE Scott Steiner).

It’s also hilarious that you use late 80’s Andre of all people to justify the Mark Henry push. Late 80’s Andre was awful in the ring, but he made up for it because Andre was fantastic at calling matches and working around his limitations. Ordinarily a guy that bad in the ring would never be allowed to work the main event, but Andre was still the biggest draw in the business, so I’m totally fine that Andre was given the push he was given back then.

This Henry push is nothing like that, Andre was already a huge draw and megastar by the late 80’s, and was able to call the matches around his weaknesses so as to protect his opponents. Henry was never over and never put on good matches at any point in his career, but for some reason WWE decided to push him like he’s Brock Lesnar anyway. The buyrates still suck, and while the ratings have benefited from the NBA strike, they’re not better because of Henry.

Henry sucks, I wouldn’t even use him as a jobber to the stars because he’s virtually impossible for people to lift so they can perform their finishers on him. It’s obvious that the only reason he’s still employed is because of Vince McMahon’s love of big men.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 11:59 AM EST up reply actions  

All I know is that I was never one to be afraid of Mark Henry. But the night he faced Daniel Bryan on Smackdown, I could feel the hate radiating from him. He is making the most of this push and channeling the memory of past failed pushes and shitty gimmicks into some legitimately good work. The man is working his ass off, and you know, in that moment, when he confronted Bryan backstage, I thought, “That is a man to fear.”

I can’t speak for anyone else, but Henry’s new push got me interested in Smackdown again.

And dude, the NBA strike? Has anyone cared about basketball that much the last few years?

by Andre Bennett on Nov 23, 2011 5:00 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

This is how I feel.

I can’t remember the last time I was legitimately scared of a heel. It’s a god damned scripted show with characters, and I find myself being actually scared of Mark Henry. That’s how good he is.

by Kyle Rancourt on Nov 23, 2011 5:02 AM EST up reply actions  

Basketball was enormous last year.

With LeBron James essentially giving the middle finger to Cleavland by joining the Miami Heat, the NBA got better ratings than they had since the MJ days.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 9:36 AM EST up reply actions  

well said

My porn name is HogOfHawkness

by HeartOfHawkness on Nov 24, 2011 6:32 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm fine with you not liking Mark Henry.

I started rewatching WWE in Feb when Rock came back. When Henry started getting his push, I was pissed. I’ve always hated Henry because of a lot of reasons you mentioned. I don’t think anyone is saying he isn’t limited in the ring, but when you compare him to guys like Mason Ryan and Brodus Clay and say they’re the same, that’s just absolutely false.

Also, how many NBA fans decide, “Hmm, I’ll give pro wrestling a try” simply because their team is locked out? That doesn’t make sense.

Lastly, I think where you lose a lot of people is when you consistently blame him for not succeeding in the past and that’s a reason he sucks now. That’s irrational. Yes, he failed at pushes before. Regardless of whether or not the failures where his fault (most of them weren’t, but it doesn’t matter), what the hell does his past failures have to do with him being legitimately awesome right now?

By that logic, anyone that’s ever had a failed promo sucks. I’m sure glad Steve Austin as The Ringmaster worked out.

I think we all knew Henry was limited, but what’s legitimately surprised me is how good he is on the mic. He’s a terrifying heel, and even if you don’t like him or think he deserves this chance, saying he’s terrible now for a bunch of illogical, irrational reasons is kind of petty.

It’s fine to not like him. My friend hates him. But to completely dismiss his reign as anything other than an unmitigated success would be wrong.

by Kyle Rancourt on Nov 23, 2011 5:00 AM EST reply actions  

I'm not saying that the booking of Henry as a monster champion hasn't been exactly the way a monster heel should be booked.

What I’m saying is that WWE should’ve booked almost anyone else in the company to be dominant other than Mark Henry.

Henry is awful in the ring, passable on the mic, and too big for most of his opponents to lift off the ground. For a guy with that many limitations, WWE has done a phenomenal job of booking him, but considering that there are at least a dozen and a half wrestlers on the WWE roster alone who could use that huge push more than Henry, picking Henry as the guy to push nonstop is flat out insulting.

Think of what WWE could have done if they followed through on Wade Barrett, Jack Swagger, Alberto Del Rio, Sheamus, Dolph Ziggler, and Legacy’s pushes instead of killing their heat and pushing Kane and Henry to the moon instead. They wouldn’t have to work so hard to hide their top guys weaknesses, they’d stick around for a lot longer because their top guys would be younger and healthier, and there might be a chance that their top guys would become stars and draws instead of the old fat guys who weren’t good enough to become stars back when wrestling was popular. Instead, we get this shit, and it’s inexcusable.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 23, 2011 12:44 PM EST up reply actions  

I think the Henry push is part of a larger plan, though.

What happens when you have a guy like Henry who is a monster/unstoppable? Eventually they lose. He’s credible for a long time now, and whenever he loses to whoever, it also elevates them. I think the only way to book Henry is as a monster heel who squashes guys in a short time since they can’t really do much with him (like you’ve stated). I’m enjoying Henry right now a lot, but I can see this going south quickly. He is limited. But I don’t think whether or not he “deserves” it is a topic we can really debate. That’s super subjective, and none of us really know the answer to it.

I love Wade Barrett and want him to succeed. So if it takes a 6 month WHC reign for Henry to help elevate Barrett, I’m all for it.

Basically, I don’t care that it’s Henry now instead of someone else, because Henry’s character is working.

by Kyle Rancourt on Nov 24, 2011 4:24 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Part of a larger plan was the exact same excuse that people used back when Kane was booked to steamroll Smackdown.

Said “larger plan” was having the worst feud of the year with Edge, and having Kane lose the title to Edge in a Fatal Four Way TLC Match so Kane didn’t have to eat the pin. It’s also incredibly apparent from the Smackdown spoilers that WWE’s going to protect Henry from actually having to eat a pin or tap to Danielson barring some drastic change in the booking plans.

Not to mention, it’s incredibly easy to tell weather or not someone deserves a push.

Is the crowd reacting to them without the company pushing them?

Are they putting on good matches?

Can they cut good promos?

Are they charismatic?

Do they have a future?

Did they succeed in the last role the company placed them in?

Are people buying their merchandise?

You don’t have to meet all those requirements, but you at least have to meet a few. Mark Henry was getting close to zero crowd reaction his entire career before he steamrolled the entire Smackdown roster this year. Henry’s matches have been consistently terrible with the possible exception of that one Rey Mysterio match he had that wasn’t horrible, but wasn’t special by Rey Mysterio standards. His promos aren’t bad, but they aren’t particularly special. He’s 40; for a man of his size, that’s a lot older than it looks on paper. And while it shouldn’t be expected for heels to sell merchandise comporable to that of the top babyfaces, when you have as many weaknesses as Mark Henry, you need to sell merchandise to justify any push.

Not to mention the fact that all of Henry’s previous pushes before now have been utter disasters in terms of drawing money and putting on great matches. Sure, WWE didn’t book Henry to steamroll the entire roster back in 1996, 1998, 2002, 2003, 2006, 2007, 2008, or 2009 when they last gave him huge a huge push, but they still booked Henry to be very strong, Henry even racked up non-title victories against Randy Orton and Rey Mysterio while they held their brands championship. If a guy can’t make things work with that many chances, booking them to be so dominant makes no sense.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 24, 2011 5:41 PM EST up reply actions  

By shit you mean actual good wrestling. Totally inexcusable

by Dr.Victator on Nov 25, 2011 8:31 AM EST up reply actions  

Why yes. How could anyone forget such one star classics as Randy Orton vs. Mark Henry, Sheamus vs. Mark Henry, and the sixteen minute classic that was Mark Henry vs. Big Show at Survivor Series this year?

Before you bring up those two half decent matches Henry had with Big Show, think about what Henry actually did in those matches. In the Vengeance match, Big Show did all the interesting offensive maneuvers, and took the biggest bump of the match, Mark Henry laid on the Big Show’s leg for five minutes. In the MitB match, which lasted only six minutes, Big Show also did all the interesting offense in the match while Henry laid on the Big Show’s leg.

Once it came time for them to actually wrestle a match, Henry gassed, and the match totally stunk up the building, and contrary to what RAW would condition you to believe, come time for a WWE PPV WHC match, you are expected to actually wrestle a 20 minute match on a regular basis. Henry can’t even go for 15. How is Henry supposed to get anybody over if by the time of the actual payoff match, he completely stinks up the building?

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 10:28 AM EST up reply actions  

Ooh star ratings. Orton/Henry was a great match and the Sheamus matches have been good.

Your bullshit comes down to movezzzz

The matches all told a good story and had cool shit like Henry tossing around a giant.

by Dr.Victator on Nov 25, 2011 11:05 AM EST up reply actions  

It wasn't about moves.

Those matches were slow, psychology free, completely lacking in brutality, and possessed zero crowd reactions throught the actual match. The Sheamus match in particular was terrible, but the Orton match was even worse, because of all the great wrestlers like Wade Barrett, Alberto Del Rio, and Sheamus, who could really have used a clean, dominant win over Randy Orton or a comparable star, WWE picks Mark Henry.

It’s not about MOVEZ, it’s about the fact that Mark Henry has the worst cardio on the roster by far.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions  

This was a good article. I don’t really agree with most it, but it’s well-written. As for Henry, I am enjoying his performances right now. He’s not working as a heel for me, because I am rooting for him, but then I’m rooting for him because he is not Cena or Orton, and because he is getting a decent run with the belt instead of being made to drop and regain and drop and regain so that WWE can get .01 more points in the ratings.

In short, I think Henry is doing a good job, but what I’m really cheering for is competent booking.

by Finian1 on Nov 23, 2011 9:31 AM EST reply actions  

I've only recently tuned in again..

I was surprised to see Mark Henry as champion and I’m personally not a fan. But I agree with most people that he’s far more interesting and looks the part. To someone who comes along, the old WCW title looks way more credible than the current raw one too. That belt looked okay on Del Rio but it’s such a blingy piece of junk. Can Punk change it now it’s his?

I have to say I’m surprised Henry is still with WWE and world champion though. Back when I was a kid he was such a joke.

The only new wrestler I really like is Seamus even though he’s a Hoss. I think he would make an awesome champion, maybe he could even slam Henry?

by The Buke on Nov 23, 2011 6:46 PM EST reply actions  

Reading from the comments

I don’t even have to criticize this piece any further. All I have to say is be careful because you too could enter the Hall of Pain.

Me against the world is a mismatch in my favor.

by batman713 on Nov 24, 2011 1:27 AM EST reply actions  

Judging by how quickly Mark Henry gasses

I could probably avoid the Hall of Pain by gently jogging around Henry while he tries desperately to reach me, and then gives up after five minutes.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions  

Mark Henry sucks for many more reasons than just cardio.

Henry’s also a shitty wrestler, has a limited moveset, limited flexibility, overuses restholds in short matches, too heavy for most of his opponents to lift off the ground, and Henry can’t jump high enough to make it look like those guys can actually lift him. The thing is, a lot of those flaws are directly because of his crappy cardio, so I focused on that in my retorts.

Henry’s also been obscenely overpaid throughout his entire career, and is so bad in the ring that WWE actually sent him down to developmental for longer than a year as a tenured employee. Despite all this, Henry has continued to recieve huge pushes and main event PPV’s throughout his career because of Vince McMahon’s love of big man. There’s no justifying that the effort to push Henry would’ve been far better served at pushing almost anybody else, but Vince McMahon didn’t go that way because nowadays, he values being a long tenured employee more than putting on good matches and actually being over.

by *Asterisk* on Nov 25, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions  

I can’t believe I just read all of those comments. Now I’m going to go home and split wigs with Mark Henry in WWE12.

by King Oskar on Dec 2, 2011 2:51 PM EST reply actions  

I know, right? Especially since the folks here are passionately debating about Mark Henry, of all people.

I’m digging Henry’s current title run, and nothing anyone can say will persuade me to change my mind at all.

Good job by Asterisk, and all those who commented, for being professional, and going into detail why they agree or disagree, instead of something like, “Ur soooo wrong! or, U suk! or, I h8 ur faise!” Well done.

by GunShark on Dec 2, 2011 11:27 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

rec

I definitely enjoyed the conversation in this thread. I may not agree with what Asterisk is saying but props on an excellent FanPost.

Maslow's theory of higher needs does not apply to Patrick Willis. He only has two needs: tackling people and finding people to tackle.

by 49erLou on Dec 3, 2011 2:54 AM EST up reply actions  

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